Lads, it seems our thread is bumplocked again. As such, another thread for your Britpol needs. This edition starts with the on-going Liverpool Conference, which seems pretty based so far.
want me to make the previous thread cyclical?
gimme a yay or nay
I normally make these threads and I want to say nay: purely from the standpoint that it is nicer to renew every one in a while.
If god forbid corbyn loses the next election will their still be a chance for someone with similar views to him to step up to the plate or will the blairites basically use it as a excuse to throw away everything corbyns done?
Chances are a soft-left person will take over, so the ideas will be watered down but the Blairites will never get in power in Labour again, not for a long time.
Besides a lot of the Corbyn project is extra-electoral: it's trade unionists and civil society orgs working together for a lot of shit.
When will Corbyn and MacDonnel exile all the Tories to the frozen gulags of Newport?
The left is firmly in charge of Labour now. Corbyn won a massive mandate in 2016 when Labour was doing shit in the polls so I don't think electoral failure would make much difference. And now that you only need 5% of MPs to nominate a leader there's no chance of a Corbynite candidate failing to get on the ballot.
Well it's 10% but I imagine next election we may see at-least two Corbynites, more if soft-left pro-Corbyn peeps like Rayner or Lammy get on.
All of the conservative student union members at my uni (of which there are very few) literally look like reviewbrah but of course without the charm.
Yeah tbh. I have never met a young tory member that wasn't a right prick, and I'm from a tory safe seat.
if Jezza loses, you lot should just go full-on Robespierre on the blairites, completely unironically.
CONSERVATIVES ARE SOCIALISTS
something something NAZBOL GANG
Luciana Berger has demanded (and got) a police escort at the Labour conference because she is so very at risk of antisemitic violence. Pretty brave of her to come at all tbh.
spot the difference
pro tip: you can't
Why did the unions help block mandatory reselection? And will it get through next year?
first as tragedy, then as farce
Melenchon and Corbyn are not sons of rich capitalist parents to my knowledge? Have they written any noteworthy books? Also Marx was German while le Melon man is French.
Other than that yeah, totally identical.
I fucking love HItchens. But yes, his "Blair was a eurocommunist, Corbyn is a patriotic British socialist" is wrong, it is also useful for selling to various people. Also he equates eurocommunism with idpol and thus separating Corbyn from idpol is a good thing.
>this level of autism
The next leader of the party will be on the left and will be endorsed by Corbyn. But unfortunately the Bennite roots of Corbyn and McDonnell are not shared by the younger generation of the Labour left, which is far more pro-EU and less sympathetic to genuine socialism. I fear that while guys like McDonnell are constantly trying to pull Labour leftwards (towards their privately held positions), their replacements will be satisfied with what Corbyn leaves them.
I fucking hate the Hitchens, both of them. Middlebrow brainlets with delusions of grandeur. Maybe they're a bit more interesting than generic liberals or conservatives but they have promoted horrible shit and contributed to the perception that leftism is something to be grown out of.
Lads, I fear that if Jezza wants to win the election, he will have to capitulate to the EU to gain the votes of pro remain and soft brexit voters which if he does will curtail their control over the economy. If the tory deal fails to pass(which it probably will) and a new election is called, Labour must run on a platform of at least soft Brexit if not a second referendum or even just flat out remaining. What can be done to ensure UK's economic independence in case of a Corbyn government?
You forgot to mention that their beards are inferior too.
Also fuck me this is quality, the real good stuff.
Can anyone here explain how electionds in the UK work? Like how are PMs elected.
Had me until the nogs and the wogs.
You know it's insincere.
I will remember when people say Corbyn is pro-Brexit more than UKIP.
And I will tell them he lies.
Nah mate, there's a lot behind the scenes: Pidcock is almost certainly a crypto (she did poli in Manchester and her other actions say it), Momentum has a lot of interesting radical stuff, the fucking Fabians are saying people need to go further and an entire generation is actually getting educated. The thing is with Corbynism is that it cannot be killed: it is in the heart of a generation now.
You would rather see us all suffer than help a few people with more melanin: just admit you're a cunt lad.
bet you don't even live near any of them lad.
Nah, m8, I would like to help brits, not nogs and wogs.
I would prefer not to.
Nah, all we need is a soft brexit deal that is far /enough/ away so we can ignore state aid rules. He knows the game, McDonnell knows the game, and while Kier is a remainer at heart he is also committed to the platform: and considering his understanding of EU law he will find a way of making it work. It is true that the remaining Kippers and Lord Tory Brexiteers will get triggered by the deal but tbh Britain doesn't need free trade, just the ability for the state to reorganise our economy. Besides, European capital has far greater threats than a reasonable brexit (Italy for example).
Also there is the 2019 election factor: if Varoufakis GANG does well we will be bretty gud.
Restructuring the economy helps them since it helps us all, you would rather not see that happen because it helps them and thus condemn us all.
Fuck off bruv, you're no better than a tory.
I would remove them while we are restructuring the economy m8.
>this whole article
So you don't live near none of them, yet you want to remove them? fucking mug, you'd rather keep the boot on everyone in this country because you might not get your Nazi masturbation fantasy, bet those fucking "wogs" & "nogs" care more about this country and the people that live here than you do, so why shouldn't we remove faggots like you?
Yes, deport people who were born in this country to where exactly?
Yeah, I would prefer not to.
To where their ancestors come from, just ask them, they will tell you. They are incredibly proud of their home country.
And for what purpose? What if they say Britain? I me-.
>Yeah, I would prefer not to.
See you are just a closet tory, shilling for capital because black people might be helped in its felling. Fuck off cunt.
so uh. the french-canadian-descended part of my family would have to go back, right? or do the white ones get to stay?
Just depopulate Britain until it's only people of 100% Celtic ancestry tbh
Purging the Norman aristos and the krauts is the first step to british socialism.
For the brit people of course.
Wogs and nogs do not believe in Britain. This is not America.
Yes, because french means african nowadays.
One of the finer parts of growing older is gaining appreciation for things, Peter Hitchens certainly did so, and I appreciate his reminder that the world is a lot older and bigger than the youthful perceive it to be.
What is this, the 1970s?
Tbh the celts were European invaders we need to pure everyone since they original neolithic population is dead.
>Britain isn't America
>Advocates for Mutt "White Race" ethnonationalism
Pick one lad
We need to reconstruct neolithic as a language of our people, create our neolithic nationalist party, get official minority status for our neolithic people and get the EU declare it a human right violations of a national minority if we lose funding.
West Doggerland for the Doggerlandix.
We Doggerlandix demand an end to indo-european colonial normativity, the stigmatization and marginalization of the traditions of the Doggerlandix community is fuelling a climate of hatred and exclusion. We demand a BBC Doggerland.
We also demand terrestrial land rights over the entirety of the north sea, a part of our ancestral home.
People vote for the MP who represents their constituency.
The MP's are usually members of a party.
Members of the party select the person they want to be leader of the party (JC or Theresa May)
The MP's nominate a prime minister from among their ranks.
The party with the most MP's gets to choose, and they will choose their party leader.
Technically you are only voting for your local MP, but most people are swayed by who the prime minister will be, and vote on that basis.
can someone post the stewart lee bit and tell this guy to fuck off?
WE LOVE YOU ARSENAL, WE DO. WE LOVE YOU ARSENAL, WE DO OHHHH ARSENAL WE LOVE YOU
100% they do not sing that: the syllaballs don't fit.
will there be football culture under socialism?
sounds fine to me. then again I pronounce arsenal closer to "arse-null" so whatever
And when is the next election happening?
Most fans I know say "Ar'-sen-ull".
Scheduled for May of 2022, likely to happen before that. An election requires 2/3rds of parliament to approve it or a no confidence motion ot pass and 14 days of no one being able to form a government.
Of course, but like in Yugoslavia all clubs will be called
Red Star, Young, Steelworks, Partisans, Brotherhood, Unanimity and so on
fair. guess it's a black country pronunciation thing, since "arsenull" is basically how I've always heard it here
Excuse me this is an lfc thread
Thing is I'm from the East of England, which would make you think we pronounce it differently but nowadays most gooners commute into London.
makes sense since Woolwich Arsenal commuted into North London to begin with.
union FCs would be pretty fun.
Tbh Momentum organised an international five-a-side footie tournament.
>All these posts
Any anon's here got a clip of Jason Unruhe saying "Fucking end yourself"?
Anyone here been watching that Michael Palin doc on channel 5 where he's travelling to Best Korea?
So is Corbyn a socdem or a demsoc? What are your takes?
Legitimate DemSoc, and his is surrounded by actual marxists.
I haven't watched it yet, but I've always assumed Palin is atleast roughly left wing considering he was part of Monty Python.
I'll update when i see it tomorrow.
DemSoc LARPING as SuccDem
How do you guys know he’s a legit comrade and not a socdem?
You managed to see it yet?
I thought it was pretty good, aside from a couple dumb things he said in the narration where I couldn't help but eye-roll
Pic related is his best mate and shadow chancellor.
Monty python might be situationists tbh, Terry Gilliam made fucking Brazil, a major part of their shtick was deconstructing british nationalism & reactionaryism that existed in the 1960s & 70s, Cleese despite being a Liberal since the 1980s supports Corbyn & calls the media out on its shit, and they sound familiar at-least with some marxist theory & university trotskyism (people's front of Judea, Marx vs Lenin vs Mao vs Che gameshow ect.).
Eh opinion of DPRK is changing: the common line atm should be encouraging peaceful and mutual reunification of the two Koreas: that way you shut down the libs and the warhawks.
Yeah i just saw it a few hours ago, i feel pretty much exactly how you do.
I really really appreciate how respectful he was, he didn't once talk down to anybody, and a part from a few parts of the naration which he probably HAD to say tbh the whole thing was great
I havent watched as much Monty Python as i should have, but i always assumed they were leftists because of that bit in Holy Grail with anarcho-syndicalist commune joke plus the "peoples front of Judea" vs the "Judean peoples front" joke
I don't know if they are leftists, but they have a very solid understanding of marxism et al.
As I said, John Cleese was an Alliance and then Lib Dem supporter.
>"IF COMMIE CORBYN IS IN CHARGE ITS GONNA BE MUH 70S ALL OVER AGAIN!!!!!"
>"MUH FILTHY WORKING CLASS "UNIONS" STOPPING TRAFFIC DAY AFTER DAY WITH THEIR "STRIKES"!!!!"
IF a hard Brexist happens, there’s no going back. England left the ship. There’s no going back. No “second referendum” or anything else. Besides if it’s smarter for Britain to trade with former colonies like India than with the EU. Besides a lot of the people who want a second referendum are petty bourgs and labor aristocrats. Jermy will be wasting his time trying to court him. Instead he should go after workers in the North of England who vote UKIP or don’t vote at all.
When Jermey comes to power, should he kill all the aristocrats, or let them live in a new home.
>who vote UKIP
Literally who does that? LMAO
They can just go to Canada as the Escape plan states and we can Jam all TV and Radio Broadcasts from that Doomed continent
MonarchyBoos Burgers and AnCraps can all just go live together
In 2015 they had 10% of the votes.
mind if we borrow corbyn a bit? we need it badly rn
Watching this, and thinking about what Labor is offering and what the Tories have done to Britain, i honestly struggle to find any sort of reason as too why anyone from the working class wouldn't vote for them. Am i just incredible disenfranchised from the average working class voter? Is there something I'm missing from the Tories that make people go "hey i know that by all means my life would be far easier for myself and far better for my children with better healthcare, free transport, controlled capitalism and power being given to the workers, but this election I'm voting Conservative"
Like it honestly boggles my mind that someone who works a 9 to 5 job and gets yelled at by their boss on the daily could watch that and immediately discard Labor as a real option
I don't disagree with Jeremy wasting his time courting 2nd Referendum people, because that's just a strategy to split the leave vote and basically no-one wants the hardest possible Brexit because that just gives license to Tories allied with Domestic Capital to absolute gut the Working Class in the intermediary. However people in the North of England don't vote UKIP for the most part, UKIP is a meme party and at least 60% of former UKIP voters came back to Labour after Brexit was won, because the working class in a place that was decimated by Tories aren't so spooked that they would vote to get fucked again.
I know but I really doubt the PVDA is gonna follow his advice
if they're not retards they should already know what to do, you don't need corbyn to tell you to reject neoliberalism
Never underestimate the power of class cuckery.
A lot of working class people do not vote, a lot of it has to do with New Labour cucking out and general apathy: it can be best explained by the 4th most "non represented view" being anti-war, despite Labour last election running on an perhaps the most anti-war platform it has since 1983. Also a decent amount of working class people voted tory in 2017 because they want to see brexit: in a post-brexit election Labour could really court those people back. And a decent chunk of nationalists are turned off labour because "muh mudslims" or "muh gommunist traidor".
What does labor offer the working class? It offers a lot to the middle class but I haven't seen much in the way of working class policies.
What labor will do when they get in is appease the middle class with "affordable housing" in London (meaning housing that's NOT affordable to the working class but is just in the range of middle class incomes). And give some concessions to students.
Labor realizes who the voices are in the UK, if you appease the middle class, they will extol your name in the press/media. The working class will not. Working class people get token appearances and are hardly seen again until some middle class prat wants to legitimize himself/herself as a "leftist".
Labor is not doing anything about this. NHS will proceed to be under threat from further public spending cuts even under labor.
Sorry for being cynical but all I hear are weasel words.
You legitimately don't understand what Labour is offering: for example last week McDonnell put forward a plan for 10 million workers in this country to gain representation on boards and income directly from company profits. And this is just the start. We are past socdem taxing and spending (which you yourself seem to doubt), we are hitting some real shit.
Oh and the best part? McDonnell has basically just said he willing to engage in Socialist Shock Therapy.
I'm actually from the UK, just my auto correct puts it back to labor.
>You legitimately don't understand what Labour is offering: for example last week McDonnell put forward a plan for 10 million workers in this country to gain representation on boards and income directly from company profits.
Germany has already done this, and it did it ages ago. 10% representation of workers in company boards won't do much when they'd get voted against literally 100% of the time.
>McDonnell has basically just said he willing to engage in Socialist Shock Therapy.
What's his definition of socialism?
Then change your autocorrect settings
Look at how many are former socialist states. Also if you add that to the cooperativisation plans, the introducing workers democracy to nationalised industries we are talking about policies that will empower and improve the lives of millions of British workers.
And that doesn't even include the plans for the mass introduction of renters' unions. you talked about affordable housing, unions will help make more houses affordable.
autocorrect is imperialist, learn to type you mong
I've been using auto-correct for so long that I've forgotten how to spell most things entirely, and have adopted the American spelling of many words like favorite.
Just one more way that American imperialism is ruining this world.
Is cricket the sport of porkies?
I think it might be cultural politics.
When I see the antics of rich californians (who to add insult to injury often consider themselves left-socialists) burning thousands of pounds on absolute crap while i try to calculate if i can afford to eat every day this week, I find myself edging towards "critically support climate change against human imperialism." side of things. Similar resentment against the same part of the UK population demographic and income distribution (well connected wealthy young metropolitan types, generally centered on London.) could surely get the same result.
You've also got immigration, but yeah.
Ehhhhhh sorta but not really. Like cricket is really popular in India and Pakistan because it can be played with a bat, ball and some sticks. It is an affluent sport but doesn't have to be.
And in recent years the class make-up of sports has changed quite a bit, football has got more affluent while rugby union has gone the other way.
This tbh, I've played sport all around my county: only the literal aristo places did polo.
It's more that it's just becoming a fringe sport due to being poorly suited to the modern age. There are other groups (most obviously Asians) that play it besides the rich. Posh people are one of the groups where cricket's influence is strongest because private schools have the space, equipment and cultural conservatism needed to sustain it. In the future football will just get more and more dominant in every demographic.
I agree on all that especially football, but I have also seen a shift in English rugby from a "middle class" (see income) sport into something more working class as the years have gone on. Maybe it's because you can actually afford the tickets and the players actually have salary caps, or perhaps it is because the RFU has just been really good at spreading grassroots stuff. Still, going to comp schools in North LANDAN that play rugby and seeing some of the best private schools in the country play them is quite a sight.
Man the tory conference is a fucking train wreck.
I cant actually believe people still take them seriously after last years conference but the shit with the app this year is even worse
How the fuck does Esther McVay still have a job. Apparently now she's claiming that Tories cutting benefits is fake news. In the words of McDonnell what a stain of inhumanity.
How is it terrible?
First day they does themselves, next one is three turns trying to launch leadership bids. Today Hammond is saying he is keeping austerity.
Oh also Hunt compared the EU to the USSR and that has triggered a lot of liberals so there was that shitshow.
What was the thing in Albania in the 1980s?
Also tbf this isn't the first time. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Festival_of_Britain
Delusional, people from Liverpool identity as English strongly
>father of 6
I see what you're upto sir.
I know it isn't but the last one was stupid too, the only good one was the very first one
I was thinking of Yugoslavia, fuck me
>blair was right
Most shameful thing there tbh
Out of everything why did that trigger you? Do you actually know why those people use that banner?
trust fund ponces, all of them. bet they all claim to be "working class" as well.
tbh they all look exactly like what you'd expect a tory to look like, they've all got that "touch of incest" look about them
If people with severe heritable genetic diseases are allowed to marry, it's only fair that cousins/siblings should be allowed to do the same.
It's not like marriage is necessary or sufficient for reproduction anyway.
Also the, the one bird looks kinda slavic: wouldn't be suprised if she was a daughter of an oligarch.
I assumed it was due to Liverpool's Irish heritage the. It was just a meme, not sure why anyone would get triggered by it. Also we need an English parliament.
Not from Liverpool myself Lad, but yeah Irish Heritage is part of it (something like 25% of people are Irish there), the other part is the fact that the City was left to rot after being such an Important Port City (and Cities with Industry like that are usually a bit different anyhow given all the interaction with other peoples and cultures). After WW2 Britain sort of just stopped investing into the City and it fell into massive decline more or less intentionally. The 80's and Hillsborough plays a bit part of it as well, considering Liverpool had an awful reputation by that time and that was seized upon to cover it up & smear by Thatcher. All of this has a lot to do with why Liverpool has such a strong Leftist presence as well.
Lmao lad the reason they're all inbred fucks is because they don't want to sully their "superior" bloodline with us plebs.
That and they want to collect capital together.
Right but you can have a political marriage and LARP as Aristocracy without actually fucking your Sister. On another note, Imagine actually being a Young Tory, do you think they even consider themselves humans because I certainly fucking don't
I've met plenty of people who tories who are my mates and I have fought for & they would fight for me: I have never met a young tory that wasn't a cunt.
I was trying to think of something funny to put with this but I couldn't manage. Does give me flashbacks to those clips of people saying this she comes across as a much stronger leader though.
In other news she's apparently claiming that austerity is over now.
>In other news she's apparently claiming that austerity is over now.
tbh i could see the tories running with this, with labour rallying against austerity and its effects tory ministers can just repeat 'austerity is over' over and over again in every interview while acting incredulous every time its brought up.
>Out of everything why did that trigger you
liverpudlians like to arrogantly act progressive
>Austerity is over
<Hammond literally said it wasn't yesterday
Imagine this level of message coordination.
I'm from London Lad chill
In unrelated news, some interesting stuff from Notes from Below on unionisation.
Nah it's gone too far now. I don't know what would happen if Corbyn did not win the next election, but it would be brutal for people in the UK to have to face more tory cuts
We're being raided by the /rightypol/ discord
Honestly, Corbynism is going to continue even if Blairites somehow did take-over control of Labour again. Simply put, the strikes yesterday are a direct result of Corbyn bringing leftwing ideals to the fore, such a process cannot be undone. If the miners had won in the 1980s, things could have gone pretty radical: now we are facing a situation where we may start seeing mass unionisation of the service sector in a post-industrial neoliberal economy, I don't really know of an example of this (even in nominally social democratic states today, service sector is more industrial & industrial services, rather than retail). Corbynism, like the Benninism it is descended from, has caused a massive quasi-independent surge in leftwing activism, the difference now is instead of having to defend a set of conditions while trying to advance in certain sectors, we have to change far worse conditions and advance in all areas: it is the irony of neoliberalism that it has shattered the structure of proletarian organisation that we get to start from the bottom and do it better this time. It's why even a one-term Corbyn government that fails to do a lot of the things it plans will be an immense success, because of what is going on in civil society. We are starting to see the dawn of a new mass movement towards trade unionism, cooperativism, and social ownership, only a military coup or invasion could stop it. The dialectic is in motion comrades, and no man can stop it.
fucks sake what an absolute king.
Well that's certainly an optimistic read, but I think I generally agree with the diagnosis. What's also interesting about the potential for new service sector unions lies in the very reason service sector was previously poorly unionised. Bosses and bootlicks always say for services the people doing the work are replaceable. What they mean is that they are interchangeable, but irreplaceable. I think that might be a strength now.
Well there was a moment in the early 1980s where things could have gone another way: but then some argies decided to be cunts, and then maggie defeated the miners. Here we have no such dilema: there is no foreign policy Hail Mary May can undertake (even if Russia invaded, there would be a large pushback from both socialists and conservative nationalists against it), and there is no "big bad union" for her to break. If Corbyn is defeated, like hell the IWGB, IWW et al are going to stop their unionisation efforts: and with that comes an epoch where there will be a large militant labour movement fighting a generally neoliberal government with few legs to stand on.
It seems like the EU is willing to bail Theresa May out after all. The corbyn project is effectively finished now that May used her slippery fat assed body out of karma and effectively bought herself a few more years as the prime minister.
Fuck and I was even having hope for the U.K.
Wait how do you get "May securing a brexit deal" leads to Corbyn dying?
Isn't that what everyone pissed off at May for?
>The EU’s vision for future ties with Britain will contain “about 30-40 percent” of May’s pitch for a wide-ranging trade and security deal
>The offer falls short of what May wants, potentially making it harder to get the deal approved in the U.K. Parliament, where she faces opposition on all sides. However, the document is expected to be vaguely worded, and with as much positive language as possible to help her sell it at home
Wow, it's literally nothing.
If you kept up to speed with Brexit news for the past year or so you'd know this is nothing, 'anonymous brussels sources' saying the eu is open to negotiating a trade deal is what has happening every other week since the referendum. And given that this sharticle actually says this proposed trade deal would only fulfill 30-40% of May's wishlist makes it double-nothing. If anything this sort of rumour from brussels just further encourages Boris and his faction to sharpen the knives all the more against May.
Like if May secures a brexit deal that is in popular terms a "betrayal", she's fucked. If secures one that the right-wingers in her party cannot accept, she is fucked. If she accepts one that requires a customs border down the Irish sea, she is fucked. If she secures one that is slightly too hard and alienates economic, soc lib europhiles, she is fucked. Like legit the margin of error where she is not fucked is very small, and add to that with Brexit done a lot of 2017 tory voters will dealign from the party. Brexit existing as a concept is one of the few things keeping it afloat atm, once a deal is done it will shit the bed.
I wonder who's going to replace him?
Gulag everyone in the north
When do you boys think the next election will be?
2019. May's Brexit plan will fail in one way or another. Only reason why it wont would be Labour MPs voting with the goverment
The north has always and will always been more class conscious than the south.
2018, the DUP are about to fucking torpedo May.
It really isn't just Brexit. Austerity, the absolute mess that the NHS is under the Tories, the railways (there's been a lot of strikes lately), Brexit is by no means the only reason people hate May and the Tories.
What are the polls showing for Labour’s chances of winning?
If the DUP ends up starting the process that puts Corbyn into government and reuniting Ireland, may they forever be remembered in the history books as the greatest and most successful Irish socialist vanguard in history XD
I wouldn't be so sure on the bottom laddie: Labour is moving towards a, albeit nonsectarian, unionist stance in NI. Len McCluskey, a major Corbyn ally and hard socialist is suggesting Labour runs in NI as a proper party.
But yeah, critically support the DUP against tory imperialism tbh.
Labour has always been unionist, not in the way old Tories are but in the sense that they have historically not given a single shit about NI or what goes on there no matter how heinous it might be. UK Labour in NI would go nowhere, they'd be better off just allying with People Before Profit or some party like that, a party that actually has some existing infrastructure in place across the island.
I follow you, but I never thought labour would deliver Ireland. But if there's a no deal Brexit theres a possibility the north might end up fucked outta the Union through vote or the material conditions anyway, and the DUP will end up having supported policies that delivered it.
We can only but dream my friend.
And if it happens I propose a statue of Arlene Forster similar to the one of big Jim Larkin in Dublin :L
Labour already do this with the SDLP they used to have a few seats but not since 2017. They are anti-violence but republican and not as left wing as SF. British parties aren't really meant to get involved in NI politics (the torys run sometimes though) as part of the peace process
I figured this might be the best place to put this question, but can someone give me a tip on which British communist party to join? I'm kind of a trot but don't worship him like some do, and I have a real fetish for Cockshott and basically any idea in TNS. I really don't want to join some super cultish party like the CPGB-ML seem to be with their Stalin banner, but equally well there seems to be so many different trot parties each with about 10 members its just a fucking mess. Which parties are other people in?
Pretty much all British commie parties are shit, the decent ones are really just groups of old retired socialists. Do what most commies are doing and joining labour
I'm not a member myself since i've been holding off but my sympathies and views happen to align pretty well with the IMT/Socialist Appeal.
But overall in the British left today there are two trends which dominate and every group will fall into, the pro-labour and anti-labour, where you have a whole bunch of old left wing parties and organisations pouring back into the labour party since Corbyn became leader to work with it or within it in with various hopes whether that be a 'socialist labour government', moving the the overton window left or practicing entryism again and making sure labour becomes a workers party. groups like the IMT or CPGB fall into this category. Then you have the leftist groups which are convinced labour is and always will be a bourgeois liberal party and that social democrats can't be trusted and will betray the workers and continue to advocate a wholly independent platform. The CPGB-ML falls into this group.
I guess the real question is what are you trying to get out of party membership? Are you looking to meet likeminded comrades? find an org which has good marxist teaching resource? is doing activism and organising or doing trade union work?
Alan-Woods Britrot anon at it again with the good advice.
Also if you are interested in Cockshott, you might want to follow the work of Novara & Aaron Bastani: he isn't a cybernetistrist (he is a technocommunist) but he has interesting stuff.
Thanks for the info.
I suppose what I'm really looking for is partly meeting new people but mostly activism and doing stuff. In terms of teaching, I'm not sure what that really entails as I've never been in a party, but honestly I like teaching myself so I can come to my own opinions without slavishly following 'the party line'. I am tempted to join Labour and I nearly did a few months back but then I lost a bit of faith when they started harping on about second referendums and all this liberal bullshit.
Yeah I've seen some of Novara's videos they're pretty good.
Depending on where you live, Momentum might be an option: they normally engage in activism. There are also orgs external to any party that campaign on issues: People's Assembly on austerity, Stop the War on imperialism, and the like spring to mind. Another good lot are the IWW & IWGB, who are working to unionise "gig economy" workers. But honestly I would recommend joining the Labour party purely for the experience of working with fellow CLP members: especially if you are not in a tory seat. Without an elected MP, CLPs tend to focus far more an activism and trying to fix shit in their local areas.
Yeah I may well join labour/momentum - my constituency is a tory one so it would be good to do some activism there. The IWW seem cool but I'm in education not in a job so joining a union would seem a little weird. And the suggestion about non-party orgs is a good one. My fear with joining labour though is that I would have to gag my communism and pretend just to be a socdem…or is that not the case?
Speaking from experience as-long-as you aren't talking about foreign policy issues or trying to praise the Soviet Union people are normally fine: honestly you may have more problem with being anti-EU (depending on the area) than talking about expropriating the capitalist class. I mean tbh focusing on how Venezuela is actually alright or how Honecker was a good egg is pretty autistic if you are in a CLP anyways so as-long as you are normal you should be fine. YMMV though, so lay-low to begin with.
A mate sent me this beauty from the DUP in 1975.
Labour was also against the EU back then.
Labour DIVINELY INSPIRED BY CHRIST CONFIRMED
SDLP are New Labour types at best, if that alliance still exists it should be severed ASAP
The alliance is effectively dead: they have been in talks for a while to join Fine Gael, the SDLP leader refused to show-up to this year's Labour Conference, and there are talks of Labour turning its wing in NI into a fully-fledged wing of the party that will run candidates for Westminster and Stormont (lol). I wouldn't be surprised if both things happen within the next 6 months.
It is an interesting change since it might be a response from Labour as a result of 2014: you can't be for half the union, so in opposing Scottish independence it has naturally shifted to favouring ulster unionism (although ofc not becoming a party of ulster protestants). I think it has some interesting implications, like the fact Ulster will gain a unionist party that is left-wing and also not run by loyalist fucks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_Unionist_Party), and also as northern ireland shifts away from "Irish vs British" & the concept as a Northern Irish Identity grows (with which according to the 2011 census 29% of people identify" there may be an interesting opening for Labour. Add to that the fact that when Corbyn went to Queens in Belfast for a talk he was recived with quite a lot of support by youngsters there suggests a Corbyn-led Labour party in NI could do rather decently.
Although I say all of this, a border poll post-brexit is all but inevitable so there's also that.
also not a member of anything, but will say that IMT are easily the least retarded british trots imo in that they don't alienate themselves like most other brit commie groups
>wash car for about 2hours
>return for a bit of relaxation
>autistic anprim? /pol/yp is still playing the internet tough guy
Go to sleep faggot, you have school tomorrow
Lad you're behind the times. Us on the "hard left" are all anti-Semites in the UK anyway because the news said so.
Has anyone read "Alternative Models of Ownership"? It's a report made by economists in the Labour party about different types of ownership models and how they could be implemented in the UK. Apparently it's going to be the basis for the next Labour manifesto so it might be interesting to read to see where the Labour party is heading
I have, it offers an insight into the fact they are genuinely interested in worker ownership rather than just taxing and spending. It will be gradual but pretty meaningful in macro terms.
Corbyn's deep ties to Latin America in general are quite interesting: he was at the May Day in Chile just before Allende was elected.
pre-corbyn she seemed like one of the more reasonable labour mps
imagine if a gang of roaming stalinist pogromites are plannng to kill her and they see her with one copper
Where are the 'Lenin-style bully boys' we were promised??
Sounds like a good name for a militant wing: the LsBB.
>tfw no left-wing paramilitary to march in the streets
Yeah but unless Labour repeals the 1936 public order act we'll never have cool uniforms.
>not critically supporting the kibbo kift against boy scout imperialism
Social credit is weird purely because in Canada they turned into crypto fash, but in Britain they became non-marxist proto ecosocialists.
Yeah, it is strange but to be expected. The original economic theory was just a pretty apolitical guy who stumbled on some of the same observations as Marx did but without the materialism to understand it, then Hargrave gave it political expression in Britain with the SCP but also mixed in his own christian anarchist, anti-fascist ideas with a heavy dose of anti-modernist social ecology aesthetics, but in Canada the social credit idea caught on through father coughlin-style anti-semitic christian radio preaching which led to it being rather more reactionary and not at all radical. So when The Socreds won basically total control of the Alberta local government they didn't actually dare implement anything because it was unconstitutional. Hargrave even visited them and told them to pass reforms anyway government be damned but Aberhart was a coward and did nothing so Hargrave went back to Britain calling them all cucks. The australian and new zealand socred parties went a similar way attracting anti-semites due to being anti-banking but not marxist and then faded into irrelevance.
The British greenshirts are the only ones with a positive legacy despite never getting close to power.
it sounds good on paper but literally the only chance of it working out is if Labour win the next election and are able to transform the UK to the point where the Irish border seems irrelevant. It's easy to underestimate how hard it is to break that mould, unification isn't just an issue it is *the* issue, the entire existence of NI is defined by the inevitability of the republic. Northern Irish as a solid identity will never be a thing either, the extent of their shared cultural heritage is one side inflicting apartheid and provoking a 30 year war, aside from that they're no more ethnographically distinct than the Irish people you find in Kerry or Mayo.
Fair enough anon, I imagine you know a lot more about Norn than I do.
Found this, has some hot takes from 1987s best music stars.
>I now believe that the Conservative government - particularly led by Margaret Thatcher - is the most likely of all the parties to create real jobs for the unemployed.
Gary Numan as autistic Thatcherite is always too much for my poor sides.
>Boy Scout handbook in the UK explicitly contained rules supporting employers, the royalty, and the military.
>The Boy Scouts in US emerged during the labour movement and explicitly removed these things with them abiding to requests by the IWW for the removal of all mentions of "loyalty to employers" and anti-war groups for the removal for mentions of military involvement.
Beard and Seton>Powell and West
Has Gary Numan always been this much of a Tory?
I'm a burger btw
Dude he's wearing a fucking suit and bow-tie do you even have to ask
Where are all of them now? Some of their reasons are quite insightful for singers tbh
Well obviously George Michael is dead (RIP, probably Cockshott gang ngl), rest of them are alive I think: although the only one still working properly is Billy Bragg ofc and that's only because he is a political singer.
Also interesting that Bowie at this point was mildly pro-Labour, considering his earlier actual fascist views…
Best music correlates with worst takes
A Gary Numan fan?
So is Scotland like the UKs equivalent of "the South" or Quebec?
Nah until recently Scotland was the heartland of Labour and was extremely pro-socialist, the only similarity with Quebec is their want for secession.
Nah, Scotland is pretty unique in its political terms: it has strong collectivist tendencies but with political libertarianism attached to that. It is more like Catalonia.
The very white and petit bourgeois londoner's idea of a protest: A lovely day out with your dogs
Yep, that will swing Stevenage towards remain.
The north and Scotland are poor and "redneck" if that's what you mean but they don't vote Conservative
thank god Corbyn is based and redpilled and will crash them out of the EU with no neoliberal survivors
What utterly charming people.
say that to my face you wanker
>The very white
What's that got to do with it?
Anyone have that police-protect-fascist meme image?
Counter culture indeed. Context?
I assume you mean the top half of this one?
Who the fuck designed that and thought it was good
Makes you realise that at the end of the day the power of a non-violent protest is in its potential for violence, either by the protesters or against them. When everyone knows that all the protesters are going to do is vote Lib Dem and share stuff on Facebook, the government has no reason to pay attention.
>Makes you realise that at the end of the day the power of a non-violent protest is in its potential for violence, either by the protesters or against them. When everyone knows that all the protesters are going to do is vote Lib Dem and share stuff on Facebook, the government has no reason to pay attention
I mean the whole exercise was basically an attempt to form a "third party" by using civil society elements, the existing infrastructure of the lib dems and sympathetic tory and "Labour" MPs. The reports are that by May next year several MPs will have defected and Vince Cable will step-down to allow a new leader to take his place with the aim of scoring electoral victory.
As a burger, what is Corbyn's victory plan? How does he transition his popular movement into an electoral victory and transition the UK into socialism?
>Let the Tories fuck up brexit, while still getting the hardest of hard raw dogged brexit that he secretly wants
>Sweep into power when the Tories collapse at the first post brexit election due to having completely fucked up the economy and ruined their own party
>Start doing Dem Succ shit
>Cut Richard Bransons hands and feet off and throw him to the pigs
That's the plan anyway, still up in the air as to whether it will work
very huwhite i like it
to be our side has gotten a bit of a reputation for violence recently so maybe thats why they did it
Well after victory, there will be a few steps:
- Major fiscal reform (Bringing the BoE back under government control)
- Major financial reform (raising taxes & closing loopholes along with massive spending on infrastructure & other investment)
- Major nationalisation of utilities (transport, energy, water, maybe bins, possibly defence, mail)
- Development of state-run investment banks (specifically for the financing of cooperative projects)
- Passing of a "worker's right to refusal" law to encourage worker purchase of enterprises (funded by the previously mentioned investment bank)
- Radical expansion of trade union rights
- Implementing a 33% worker stake and 10% worker dividend scheme
- Ending government austerity.
Now will this work? Perhaps not. But it's certainly a plan, and more radical than even what CPs in the West were doing in the cold war.
There are two types of people…
Most of his plan is letting the Tories fuck up. The 12.9 million votes Labour got in 2017 would have been enough to win any other election going back to 1997, so if he can hold onto those while the Tory vote falls, he's in.
This tbh: it's why I think MPs defecting to the centre would help Labour: the quarter of the tory vote that is liberal (economically, socially, politically) would be drawn towards it based on their rabid europhillia. Would do us a solid.
This might be a retarded question but please bear with me: Is there a way for Corbyn to dismantle opposition and ensure that at least for a while that Labour stays in power? I do not think that what Corbyn is planning can be achieved in a reverse shock therapy so they will need the time. Also, has Corbyn selected a successor from the new cadres? Labour needs to ensure that it stays united during the succession period, which may or may not come soon.
For "dismantling the opposition", no, not really. This is Britain, and without an actually existing revolution we're going to continue being a parliamentary democracy. However oppositions have a very good habit of dismantling themselves: and considering how the tories are headed we may get that anyways…
Regardless, 5 years will be enough to get the ball rolling for what he needs to do: the Pink tide states were able to get this going on their own and I think Labour can too.
With regards to succession, I hear various things about who will take-over but regardless: Corbyn's position is secure, he can have a succession plan and we would never know about it.
The problem I see with a quick economic independence and other pink tide reforms is that it will cause a major backlash, both internally("Corbyn is a literal commie!!!") and externally("Corbyn the evil populist, horseshoe!") and if this causes Labour to lose in the next elections(with some support fron burgers) then the new government can just rollback the reforms. Also I, maybe naively, believe that a democratic coup/revolution is possible and hope that Corbyn is the trigger of it in the UK.
The way that I see it, I don't really have much hope for the UK anymore. The fact of the matter is that after Brexit, people will just move on towards UKIP and the tories because they believe those parties would be able to keep out migrants that the lily white folk hate so damn much. Economic collapse has historical not lead people to socialism, but rather towards fascism and I sincerely believe that by 2022 we will more likely have Prime Minister Sargon of Akkad than Corbyn. It's just the facts, the power of memes have simply made CIA/M16 niggery too good. The only way people even communicate to each other is through memes. The fact of the matter is that we have already lost control, the right can simply meme better because memes are how the CIA niggers control the masses. The means of production will never fall into the worker. Essentially, porky will forever stay in power.
The fact that UKIP is doing so well right now is just fucking funny though. They have no real plan at all, and will lead UK to a path of ruin.
>implying UKIP is doing well
>implying they will ever amount to anything after brexit
>implying the tories aren't in an eternal spiral of JUSTing
>the power of memes
>The fact that UKIP is doing so well right now
People keep fucking saying this in this thread and I can only assume they're not from here, because it's such an absurd thing to say.
I know exactly what the British Bourgeoisie is planning.
1. Use UKIP in order to normalize a police state. Sargon of Akkad is famous for using "service guarantees citizenship" as a meme. I believe that the UK will become a military dictatorship due to this fact. They want to have this happen, and the fact of the matter is that most children use youtube. The first results they will find is Sargon talking about some stupid inane shit because youtube is deliberately trying to turn people into a reactionary band while wearing a "progressive" liberal mask.
2. Socialism is viewed as weak because it relies on popular support of the masses. We are associated with lepers, migrants, vagrants and other sorts while the bourgeoisie can use their wealth in order to project an aura of strength and power even though the majority of them are physical weak toads. This tricks the human brain enough that we are little more than domesticated dogs to them, to be thrown away at a whim. Carl of Akkad wishes to become a leader, and he's a well respected right-winger who is able to justify a UK military dictatorship as him as a puppet leader.
Seriously, when was the last time you closed youtube and left your mothers basement?
It all depends on if Corbyn can deliver something. Remember Neoliberalism lived on the fact it solved the inflation crisis. What Corbyn is promising are wages and growth: which while more abstract it can be achieved with what he is planning.
As for the one term stuff, well that will be more difficult: but I tell you this, one he nationalises the trains, they ain't going back into private hands bucko.
do either of you even live in the UK. UKIP is a dead party, they cant even get people run to defend their council seats never mind defend them. They occasionally get a boost in the polls by a few % when ever Brexit news looks like we are going to have a "softer Brexit" but always returns back 3-5%
All burgers see are memes about Farage.
Heard Tommy Robinson was calling for a revolution before his trial. He was going to go to jail for a year for a nonviolent offence. He's not a martyr, he's a footy hooligan. All the serious revolutionaries of the world have had to put up with far worse.
The sequel is always trash compared to the original, it won't generate as much buzz.
Be funny if Jezza gets in and these rightwing drongos try and pull that shit. Gives him the perfect excuse to go Commisar Corbyn on them.
Well the thing is the trade unionists have always been deep in the UK anti-fascist movement: so we have actual organisational structures to deal with the Tommy Thugs.
Was at a talk organised by Momentum where they had an anti-fascist community organised in working class areas and they have been growing recently: the real secret is building up local support with community events, that's how you get shit down. Football clubs are a great vehicle for this, because you can build local teams and shit like that. There are a lot of things moving forward right now, it's good stuff.
I honestly believe that Sargon will be prime minister in 10 or so years. Like bourgeois democracy has become such a circus that they'd elect a retarded cunt like that just to laugh in your face. They rape the planet and put on a show to laugh at you.
>Comrade Miliband won't succeed Corbyn leading Britain forward towards a glorious new age of British Socialism
Look at this lad.
>sargon will be prime minister
>thinking we are burgerland
are you a joke?
put your flag back on dprk-kun
>Believing that a succdem would stop a coup.
>Believing that the majority of new people raised today aren't watching Sargon videos.
>Believing that Pewdiepie's rightwing tendencies aren't rubbing off on people.
So you are DPRK poster then?
>minecraft kids will stage a coup and establish a fascist dictatorship because they watched too much pewdiepie
when you are brainfucked by /pol/ but think /pol/ is bad
immediately cut your internet connection and go outside
That actually wasn't me. My typing style is more erratic.
Do you not know that Media actually effects people? Not in the sense that violent video games will turn people into killers, but rather that by absorbing the psychic miasma that rightwing media and their sympathizers, people will grow into accepting fascist talking points.
Pewdiepie. One of the world's most hated men on youtube for a while, is getting a lot of love from the likes of uniquenamesauras (A fucking obnoxious anime youtube), EmpLemon and everyone else like them. Do you seriously believe that in today's day and age that people are any more capable of abstract reasoning, logic and critical thinking than they were in the past? No, they will accept the easy answers. Youtube is answers for people who only want them in the back of their head, always reminding them how obnoxious SJWs are whenever someone brings up shitty healthcare or the fact that we are all getting wagecucked.
I meant that this >>2690781 wasn't me.
>Reacting this seriously to a Milifan post
Okay obviously not british right here.
Is Stewart Jackson MP /ourguy/?
*dabs on your sick child*
kids who watch this shit grow out of it the moment they get into college/sixth form.
>66% of those aged 18-19 will vote labour
I remember seeing one poll which had 16-19 year olds on 75% voting labour.
I cant stand these people they turned me from a "Eu is bad but it is probably better if we stay in " to a hard core leaver. Ive seen this effect happening in my local momentum as well
>Kids who watch this shit grow out of it.
Tell it to my anime/gaming discords and I'll tell you to shut the fuck up. The fact of the matter is that conservationism/capitalism fellatio is the hot new shit in town, and it'll stay that way for a long while. It's obnoxious as shit, and I don't like it but it's reality.
So if you're not the DPRK guy, and there are at least 2 other people who post exactly like him who deny being him, then where is DPRK guy? why are there so many of you stealth niggers who spew things that are just wildly out of touch with all empirical metrics of reality, it's almost like this is some autistic discord LARP by retarded /pol/ posters or something hmmmm
No. I am the DPRK guy. The one who supported me wasn't me though. That's my fault for getting it wrong and not making the correction obvious.
Still you have to admit there is a pipeline.
Normie Friends that you watch anime with posts edgy memes → Watch pewdiepie for those memes → Get into anime → Watch something like Goblin Slayer or Attack on Titan which have obvious fascist themes → get deeper into reactionary thought through memes → end up on reddit and pretend that you're a poster on 4chan → join r/the_donald → Talk about anime with boomers and the CIA → Become programmed to complete fascism lose all of your will to think independently → annoy your family so much that you talk to them less → get deeper into the whole → Actually go on 4chan → Stay on /pol/ until the end of time.
This is the fate Generation Z and the millennial.
Yes this is why we had a communist revolution in the 1980s because everyone in the 1970s was a trot at uni.
The reason why the UK hadn't had a revolution was because the US existed. CIA niggers will use memes, no matter the source to pollute the mind's of young adults.
How many people on them are from the UK though, and even then they make up a tiny percentage of the population. Im currently at one of the famously right wing posh wanker uni's and even here the Socialist Student group has grown from about 15 members too 100+. Meanwhile telling people your a Tory pretty much means your never going to get laid. In the real world the left is getting bigger. 12 year olds on discord are not going to stop us
BEGONE T R O T
Also Durham, or St. Andrew's?
We used to be a trot front for the SWP but separated like 5 years ago. Pretty much no trots in the left-wing youth any more, people know about all the shity things they do now and how to avoid them.
Wait I thought Socialist Students was the youth wing of the SWP: unless they seperated off or something? Honestly news to me, although I avoid student politics like the plague. But tbh, if they are in SocStudents you should be funneling them to Momentum: get them working with locals to actually get stuff done in the community, you know?
Also Exeter man, I'm so sorry…
In America nobody fucks. Trump supporters find each other revolting and thus have to rely on online to have any sort of contact. The fact that most Americans are fat, Trump supporters makes it so that nobody wants to have any sex, and the age where one loses their virginity is ever increasing.
I think at the time they wanted to keep the name to piss them off. Student politics is pretty shit there is a shift away from it now and yeah momentum is about to get set up here properly as well so going to help out with that as well.
feels bad man
Also is it true all the locals hate the students in Exeter or what?
pretty much true of every uni city. It might be worse here because of the fact that historical buildings are being knocked down to build private student accommodation (always massively overpriced) but I here this is going on in lots of other places too
That's shitty they are knocking down historic buildings ngl, I mean the entire university-housing complex around a lot of unis is fucking cancerous: i am pretty sure the unis feed into corrupt landlords so they can fuck-over students and slip the uni money on the side ngl.
But yeah, as a student in Manchester I've never had an issue with locals, they tend to be pretty damn friendly if anything (although that's usual for northerners).
Yeah student housing in general is cancerous, not only does it rip off students but also forces locals out and increases rent
Bloody Beaker folk innit
Oh man both parties were pretty cringe-worthy
Further evidence Marx was a proud Nubian king and based black man.
This has actually been used to slander leftists for decades, all by the usual suspects. There was a socialist candidate in Merseyside that was drawing crowds and they started pulling it out on the radio and saying his mobs were beating up old ladies. If anyone can remind me of the guys name I'll be able to find proof of this quickly, otherwise I'll go and dig it up over the next couple of days.
I love those comments with that faggot complaining that he is being unfairly named during legal proceedings and some guy calling him out as his being "unfairly named" is purely a privilege of wealth and power.
a bloo bloo bloo what if the rich wanker Tories had to abide by the rules everyone else did?
Didn't you hear? Shilling for rich white men in the face of dem ebul femininazis is the new hot thing!
Also Kavanaugh 100% did it
The best part are the Yanks in this thread peddling bullshit. You get a few Brits doing it too but me and the lads just call them Ameribrits as their whole worldview is shaped by interaction with retarded American takes.
God forbid the American left ever seep into the UK in any meaningful way. That would be even worse.
>FF to run in Northern Locals
Its fucking Nothing
What new smear do they have against Corbyn and what is the new Budget?
Smear campaign today: Corbyn is responsible for the synagogue shooting in America, and Allende was a bad bad man and Corbyn is too for being against Pinochet. Oh also people are using the Rosa quote about Brazil (socialism or barbarism): I saw a Blairite defend Erbert, an Indy Journo claim it was a Hitler quote, and another claim that Venezuela was "socialist and barbarian".
As for the budget, sodall will change.
>Oh also people are using the Rosa quote about Brazil (socialism or barbarism): I saw a Blairite defend Erbert, an Indy Journo claim it was a Hitler quote, and another claim that Venezuela was "socialist and barbarian".
Moments like this I feel like gulags aren't a bad thing after all
The sooner socialists of all kinds accept this, the faster we can start the revolution
Gulags are redundant when we can just march every member of the conservative party and the CBI into the shard or any other number of ugly glass towers in central london and then demolish it with them inside.
Lol the Tories just announced an end to PFIs, Ragnarok is truly upon us.
What is their alternative? I fucking hate public-private partnerships and it's high time we kill this neoliberal garbage which wastes public money so that it can then be blamed on "socialism" but knowing the tories they'll just drop the contracting and instead of the state doing it in-house they'll get the private sector to fully take it over?
I honestly don't know: perhaps they will just let the investment fall by the wayside? I mean you can't 100% privatise state services, otherwise they aren't state services (we're talking about schools being built here). I also don;t know what the fatcat tory donors who made their money in PFI will say about this ngl…
>what is their alternative
you see here lies they beauty of the Tory party 2015 onwards. You don't need to do the things you say you are going to do and no journalist (not even the "center left" guardian) will pick up on it. Seriously under May pretty much nothing has happened and since 2017 its even worse.
Thing is that even if you tell people things are getting better, unless they see it fuckall will happen. The tories understand this to an extent: hence why they have a new pothole fund, but when it comes to education and local services shit isn't going to get fixed.
Add to that a lowkey but substantial rebellion among tory cllrs over the fact they have no money to do fuckall anymore.
Any academic Brits itt? Dunno if this is the olive to ask, but I'm a Burger lookin for grad programs with a focus on marxist theory. I know Fisher taught at Goldsmiths, but I'm wondering about other programs I might not know about
London school of Economics might be one to look into: considering they have marxist economists and people who worked for leftwing governments teaching there.
yeah it hasnt been in the main news much but I do keep hearing of Tory councillors attacking the central government for lack of funding, pissing off the grass roots is not great for a party with less than 100000 members and probably half of them are over 65
Well if you autistically follow local government news (like I do) you can see a load of tory cllrs either going indy, joining new parties or forming their own. HECK, Derby council was turned into a Labour controlled one because some local tory cllrs no-confidenced their own party's council. This is the level we have hit. It is quite possible that at this year's local the party might collapse because its incumbents refuse to stand, or are deselected for persistent rebellion.
While acknowleding that they are at most DemSoc lites, this sounds like playing it safe to not give Blairites any more ammunition to attack them with. If McDonnell hinted at any kind of change, they would be compared with Hitler("muh Not SocialisM"). We'll see their plans once Corbyn is in power.
I do the same. I was speaking to a guy who works with unite today and he said the budget seems like we are heading towards an election soon so they are going to have an issue if even their own councillors arent happy with them
John McDonnell is sound I cant wait when Labour gets a second term and he goes full commie
I think that he will stick to radical Socdem policies to not get A Very British Coup'ed. For the same reason, they will not leave NATO.
Yeah I heard the take about them preparing for another election too, "muh tax cuts for people" seems like a prep for that.
Honestly depends on how things go, if the US gets itself into another war, withdrawal from NATO will look like a good prospect.
On their first time they will play very carefully. But idk there is a lot of work going on behind the scenes to prep for "Very British Coup". The bigger Unions and labour are getting more involved in local communities, when stuff is going to shit people will listen to the guys who helped keep their swimming pool open rather than whatever the news is saying.
Well things are also very different from the 1980s: for example the establishment has very deliberately undertaken efforts to gut the police, which throws a spanner in the works. Add to that we live in an era where organisation can be done through dark networks by anyone McDonnell is a bright lad, he will have backup strats.
Oh, and there is also the "Robinson factor": while he himself will be an easy Quisling, his followers are pretty anti-auth and will likely riot if "the establishment" tries to take power through dodgy means.
So these councilors would not campaign and knock doors for their MP candidates like they did for the last GE?
Possibly. You have to remember that a lot of party-campaigning relies on the good will of random members. Labour is able to mobilise a lot of people atm because people give a shit, the tories have the opposite problem. Add to that, that these cllrs are actually leaving the party in quite a few cases and yeah, they may have a real problem ground-game-wise.
what >>2702702 said
Since the Torys have so few active members now who can campaign for them pissing them off is not a good move. A lot are currently pissed with Brexit policy right now. However the Torys have never relied on its membership door knocking but uses its money and control of the media instead, while Labour focuses more on members on the ground for campaigning.
textbook populism, promising the impossible, narrative of corrupt elites not listening to the "peoples will"
but effective on ledditors and succdems
You say this like it is a bad thing anon.
>Cameron says he would return to politics as Foreign Minister if May got the boot
I honestly don't know what to say to that…
(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)
You see that they're getting the Met involved with this shit now? Couldn't do anything but laugh when they brought it up on the news this morning.
They arent actually they had the head of the met on the news and she said it wasnt true that they were investigating the Labour party. Of course the headline is still going to be up
Fuckin hell of course thats the case. Should have read through again myself but still imagine how many people just heard the original thing and won't get any follow up.
Its being set up like the met is investigating the Labour party when in fact its just they are investigating individual cases ie probably half of them are fake accounts pretending to be labour party members. I also like how this is being painted like a bad thing.
>labour party does nothing about anti-Semitism
>labour party works with police to investigate anti-Semitism
>look everyone met are getting involved with Labour party anti-Semitism
Inb4 they stumble across of a load of Russian bots or something: that would make my day.
After jumping ship from the mess he fucking caused, he now wants to come back in as it sinks?
The police are basically just the fucking internet police nowadays.
>rape, assault, theft
Sorry we're too busy :o(
>someone called a blairite a niggerfaggot on facebook
'ELLO 'ELLO 'ELLO
Checked, but i'm sure you mean "…back to make sure it sinks."
So what was Labour's respond to the budget, the news was buzzing about a rift between McDonnell and Corbyn?
Now this is 4D chess
So is Corbyn and his friends showing their Actual AntiFascist Zionist power level meant to make me hate them or something?
Also do you think this recent attack will work?
>So is Corbyn and his friends showing their Actual AntiFascist Zionist power level meant to make me hate them or something?
What, reforming the AFL? Or bashing Israel?
>Also do you think this recent attack will work?
Which one? Either way, no.
Tell me your visions for the symbolism/vexillology of the inevitable NWSSR.
Pickaxes? Loom wheels? Grain? which the countryside
kulakstories are no doubt hoarding and burning right this second
Got a letter from my local tory today. I much prefer when they knock so I can have a go at them.
I think it's telling, their campaigning now consists of hiding from the public and hoping people pick up their propaganda.
I'm worried that apparently all of the Labour territory has become pro-deal referendum. I don't trust FPBE at all and I want to gulag them all. Why the fuck does nobody get you can't have state aid and nationalisation under the EU? How do these people square that circle with voting for Labour?
This but unironically.
<Not the Union of Sovereign Communes of Merseyside, and Greater Manchester
Regardless: a Bee, a Phoenix, a Ship, and a Castle.
But the strongholds go further than that. Liverpool and Manchester used to be part of Lancashire, and the whole red area emanates from it. If we start naming you two, where's the love for the place that started it all (and I'm from :^))?
Currently, the stronghold is the entire North West metropolitan areas, and it spreads from the coast to Middle England. But if we call it the North West Metropolitan Republic then we look like a bunch of Cali liberals.
That's why I want the NWSSR, because it's a pun on the USSR, and it means we can just keep blobbing everyone in our immediate range.
>How do these people square that circle with voting for Labour?
Coz they have no other option. Who are they gonna vote for, LD?
They could pull a Dan Hodges and vote Tory.
>The people whining about Brexit will vote for the party that started it and its biggest proponent
I don't think they are that dumb
Dan Hodges is literally a FBPE type who voted tory last time because "muh Corbyn".
Wait really? I thought he was a LARPer anyway.
She actually fucking did it…
You better wear your special flower, anon. You wouldn't want to be seen as unpatriotic and ungrateful, would you? Have some respect for the men that fought for your freedom.
What does it even mean? I know what it stands for but it's still deeply confusing. These 'People's Vote' activists are terrible at PR.
>who voted tory last time
Does he not vote Tory every time? Everything he writes is ultimately generic right-wing shit, despite his posing.
>Yeah I'll take the Foreign Office if you don't mind. Got any safe seats going spare atm?
The arrogance of this retard is just amazing.
Isn't this over Ireland's border though?
I dont know what it means but I know I hate them more and more everyday. They are pretty much the sole reason why people under 25 are becoming increasingly anti-EU
umm what did she do exactly?
>No anon, don't you see the poppy stands for violence and war. I am going to be woke this year and not wear one, so I will show all those Damned squaddies how much bad men they are!
Honestly pop wank triggers me so much, it started off as an anti-war symbol since it represented the destruction of the first world war. Fucking nat cunts turned it into a symbol of jingoism and retarded libs are FIGHT THE MAN by proving them right.
No joke, "follow back pro europe". It started on fucking twitter. Welcome to 2018.
He is a blairite, apparently 2017 was the first time he voted tory or some bullshit.
The border was the last thing left to negotiate.
It is basically saying she has reached an agreement with Europe. Aka, she has a brexit DEAL.
Imagine being this guy and writing these two articles just under two months apart. How can you be so intellectually bankrupt and lacking in integrity. They're running scared and throwing everything to see what sticks.
the best thing is when someone calls them out on this shit they become so defensive. I honestly don't understand how anyone trusts anything the media pumps out anymore
I mean its an effective tactic, a journalist can write an article claiming corbyn is an anti-british communist lunatic one day and an article claiming he's a trump-like anti-immigrant populist the next, a tory will retweet the former and a libdem or blairite the latter.
The inconsistencies don't matter because they'll only ever pay attention to their favourite flavour of anti-corbynism.
Anti-semitism is the special one-size-fits-all story because its the closest you can get to 'eats babies for breakfast'.
>I honestly don't understand how anyone trusts anything the media pumps out anymore
Most people don't.
turd position. Nazbol.
I wouldnt be surprised if this helps when door knocking, just point out the liberal elite hate Corbyn is probably enough to vote labour for some people
Some examples aren't really fair to include since different people can criticize Corbyn for being X or anti X. Most are true though especially this >>2708181
>Vote Corbyn to own the libs
What a truly interesting timeline we are in right now.
>What a truly interesting timeline we are in right now.
We leftwing populism now.
File: 90b098a4d216610⋯.png (Spoiler Image, 1.06 MB, 1173x881, 1173:881, tfw smelling the poormies ….png)
Fucking despicable, should all be shot.
More confused than angry. What makes them think this would be okay? Probably Tories or UKIP scum.
Judging by the accents, the nice garden and the puffer jackets: Essex Children of Thatcher.
Apparently they handed themselves in last night.
What do you think of white poppies? They seem a lot more in keeping with the original meaning of Remembrance and they piss off all the right people:
What an absolute scumbag
>conscientious objectors and pacifism in schools are 'left-wing political agendas'
Liberal virtue signalling that inherently makes the poppy a symbol of militarism.
The the best thing a lab government could do is regulate the usage of the poppy like how flags are done.
The red poppy has already become a symbol of militarism though.
Which is why you fight it rather than yielding it to the reactionaries: same with St. George's cross.
I would argue that by provoking people like >>2709679 into acting like bigoted fascists, the white poppy does a great job of exposing the rottenness of the system. And attempts to 'reclaim' reactionary symbols are usually doomed to failure - St. George's Cross has become even more associated with reaction recently with the rise of groups like the EDL.
burger here. just dropping in to see what's up. how's Brexit going?
A deal is close, but no cigar. Will be hard to get through parliament.
More people have now been arrested for joking about Grenfell than causing Grenfell.
Reminder that the moment the thousands of people who turned up the morning after to march on Downing Street over it were turned back by the police, the door closed on them ever seeing justice.
>the moment the thousands of people who turned up the morning after to march on Downing Street over it were turned back by the police
it was such a depressing moment
One guy who had lost an immediate family member wanted to fight the police, and someone else who had supposedly (wouldn't be surprised if he was a police plant tbh) lost a cousin or something talked him down because "Then we would just be as bad as them, this is not the way we should get justice". Peak fucking liberalism.
I remember thinking "Oh, you stupid fucking cunt".
>Good for Trump. CNN are not journalists. They are propagandists with an agenda.
>How will the BBC react when the evidence is made public that the UK and Australia actively tried to sabotage the election of Trump and his presidency? We've got space at Gitmo for your queen. Check the tweets of George Papadopoulos and stay tuned….
Are you feeling okay lad?
>>Good for Trump. CNN are not journalists. They are propagandists with an agenda.
>>How will the BBC react when the evidence is made public that the UK and Australia actively tried to sabotage the election of Trump and his presidency? We've got space at Gitmo for your queen. Check the tweets of George Papadopoulos and stay tuned….
I wouldn't be surprised if their were police plants there. That shit could have caused riots (and it probably should have tbh)
I think the sensible response is to just bully the fuck out of anyone that does that sort of thing, as they're either a limp wristed liberal faggot or an actual cop who double deserves it.
Another burger here, sounded like there were rumblings of a new referendum and snap election, any truth to these?
These rumblings have been going on since both the referendum and the last GE. Hopefully the Tories force through a hard brexit before GE, so then it's there problem and we can have our cake and eat it.
Anon, what's the source? This doesn't really mae sense.
>We've got space at Gitmo for your queen
wtf I love guantanamo now.
The deleted post shortly before it haha
New referendum is pretty much impossible. That whole campaign is just a attempt by the lib dems to take the remain labour vote, while the Blairites are using it as a way to attack Corybn. Its pretty much gone to shit this point with how toxic the whole thing is. New general election is likely within next year, Tory run councils are expecting one next year
On a scale of 1-10 how dead is republicanism? What types of motherfuckers actually believe in constitutionally required tea parties and jewelry? Is it just people mostly going along to get along?
BBC News Channel on youtube about Trump ranting at CNN Journalist.
This is what that guy who I steal reply to post here is talking about.
Just out of interest, what do you lads think would happen if there was another referendum and leave won again?
I can't imagine it would improve the standing of the tories
1, people used to bring it up sometimes but now there are bigger fish to fry than constitutionally required tea parties and jewelry.
Liberals would continue to bring it up every five minutes but this time they would just shout about the ADVISORY nature of the referendum and how it is a REPRESENTATIVE democracy.
They'd probably type like that too as they're becoming increasingly unhinged, they're still as spineless as ever though.
If there's going to be another referendum they'll just fluff out the original referendum and call it the "Final Say" referendum, where the answers are more nuanced than yes and no. They'll keep remain there on hoping that they're bailed out by the public.
STOP SETTING OFF FUCKING FIREWORKS
There are still English and welsh republicans kicking about but not many, there are bigger issues now and its kind of fallen by the wayside
The only place in the UK where republicanism is a widespread view is NI for obvious reasons, most people in GB don't know how harmful the monarchy are
1 - Its an irrelevant issue at this point and its a good thing. Any bourgeois republic that would be implemented would have more guards against socialists taking power. The non-constitutional parliamentary system of government aside from the obstacle that is the house of lords is best suited for radical transformation. Unironically the monarchy is good because it gives such a significant degree of potentially unchecked power to the ruling party. The monarchy can be abolished once there's certainty that the republic would be constructed on a socialist basis.
also, fucking this
Anyone else love to set a few of these badboys off just before 10? Drives the neighbours and their dogs crazy lmao, I always see them twitching the curtains after but they're too late to catch me in the act.
1 - The attitude towards the monarchy is mostly apathetic. When there is a royal wedding people are like "that's nice for them, I wish them well" ike you would if you found out your mates cousin was getting married. Active republicanism is only a thing within a certain element of the SNP and even then, not much.
Corbyn himself is a silent Republican, although he takes the right choice of not making a thing out of it because come one we have so much more shit to fix right now.
Burger here, I might be moving to L O N D O N next year as I take a year off and search for grad schools abroad. Any tips lads?
London is a massive Orwellian shithole, go north, its a lot poorer but its also got less cunts in it
So I've heard. It's just that Goldsmiths and Birkbeck are there, whose cultural studies programs I'm aiming for
So has this whole party memo thing doomed Corbyn or not?
Which one? if its the thing about getting the conference to back a new referendum I don't think it will go ahead, Momentum's hierarchy is too filled with ☭TANKIE☭s and trotskyite infiltrators to back it no matter how their consultation of their agents returns
Corbyn's friends will probably try to force as many of his enemies out before the conference as they can anyway, and few of the really powerful people in Labour will try and defy him now, Chukka etc. will still make noise but that's about as much as they can do
I don't even know what you're referring to.
Gotta remember to not read comments sections on BBC articles
They are pretty much the worse comment section of anything I have seen on the internet
This is a quality shitpost
That's just pure trolling.
Based. One thing that gives me hope for the intelligence services of the UK is the sheer amount of commies that used to be in it.
Yep, and that's the ones that we know of, who knows who else was a commie in the MI6
>abbott v peterson
POKEMON LET'S GO TWENTY POINTS DOWN IN THE POLLS!
The BBC is so full of wreckers, we could have seen JBP finally debate a Marxist with McDonnell but they completely assist him by getting Abbott in there.
Only shit that's gonna be a shit showing.
>Tory Saudi Shill
>Someone from fucking Fine Gael
>Ebic Centrist man whose parents were communists apparently
>Kermit the Lobster
This is why people think QT is a farce.
At least they're not screaming communist at the Russians like the Americans are
Real talk Putin must be pretty happy with all the shit flinging going on in the EU and NATO at the moment, you wonder what would have happened if they'd actually put into any effort into actually seriously manipulating either campaign
I hate it when people use fake cyrillic.
Tbh he has his own problems to deal with at home, and it doesn't help that just when things were getting better the west suddenly hardened against him.
Don't think it's even the biggest platform they've given him. I think he was on Radio 2 with Evans. Wonder why the BBC does this, probably someone in the offices patting themselves on the back for being so "even".
Can anyone explain to me what the hell makes UK's younger generation far more leftleaning than America's and Europe? It seems that the Generation Zyklon meme might actually be manifesting in America, however the voting trends of the UK heavily leans over towards Labour. Is Jeremy Corbyn just that based, or do people realized that the tories are just a bunch of fuddy duddies?
We never got on the idpol train.
Social politics were never as polarized here as in America
Its mostly two things imo.
- things in america have largely always been shit and you never had much in the way of a welfare state, whereas in the UK neoliberalism has wreaked destruction that is just more visible.
- the destruction is more clearly attributable, in america you have a two party system where both parties are and have been massively and eagerly complicit in neoliberalism from the start, and while New Labour under Blair was also complicit in it here, there's a memory of Old Labour which has been rekindled by Corbyn and so there is a legacy of an alternative to call upon.
Basically the US political system is so constrained the masses have blinders on and don't know what hit them when crisis hits. They don't know who to blame except vaguely the establishment and minorities, the perfect setup for fascism to exploit. In Britain the masses can more clearly attribute blame within the political system, to the tories and conceive of Labour as a way to turn back the tide.
Its also to do with the to countries being at different points in their recent political history. America had eight years of its 'left-wing' rule, whereas the UK is eight years into right-wing rule. Consider the political mood in america at the end of Bush's presidency, in the meantime we had the end of New Labour government under Brown. While for you the Republicans took the blame for Iraq and the 2008 crisis, here Labour took the blame for it. But the last eight years of things getting worse and worse in America was under islamig gommunist obummer, whereas here it was avaricious conservatives proclaiming the rule of austerity. Young people growing up since the financial crisis have grown political in a democrat run and thus ostensibly left-wing america which has evident worsening problems. British youth have grown up also getting more and more fucked but under a transparently right-wing government. Trump and Corbyn are almost similar in that they're are equivalent reactions of sorts to a mirrored political situation.
>sheer amount of commies that used to be in it.
Tbh that was mostly due to the great popularity of communism in intellectual circles and the very casual level of vetting that used to be done. In those days if you went to the right school and were considered to be a good bloke you could get access to secrets without much scrutiny into your ideology.
Didn't the UK make a huge fuss over immigration?
Because Deno, who is socially libertarian but economically leftwing, can get behind Corbyn. Like a soc of the harder soclibs join the Greens or lib dems, but the lad demographic is pro-Corbyn (look at the fact his supporters sing a football chant). So the Corbyn project has been pretty socially centrist, which has meant leftwing youths of both the liberal and libertarian types can get behind it.
Also young tories are fucking insufferable no word of a lie.
Not really, the refugee crisis never hit us and a lot of the anti-immigrant sentiment was released by the brexit vote. Since then attitudes towards immigration have swung in favour of it.
Although I should add that the lack of vetting also had positive effects. Some of the most based secret agents of that era would never have got the job today due to them being total nutcases. Look at Richard Sorge (different country I know).
>nah but seriously welbeck is a sick stirker got me 3 points on my fantasy footy team
3 points is shit I'd well be destroying this lad in the minileague.
I mean tbh putting anyone from Arsenal in your FFT is a risky move but yeah.
>In those days if you went to the right school and were considered to be a good bloke you could get access to secrets without much scrutiny into your ideology.
Kek, didn't Comrade Philby actually talk about exactly this?
You know hoe people have shit that fucked them up as a kid: i remember watching Threads at 11 and the concept of a world degenerating by being overrun with literal retards as human civilisation degrades into dust scared, and still scares me, to shit.
I honestly believe it should be a mandatory watch during one's formative years. Some psychological scars are necessary in order to form an actual understand the full horror of nuclear war.
No other film has made me feel so numb afterwards.
I keep meaning to watch this but I might wait for this release now.
I mean either way: fucking watch it. It will fuck with you, but you must regardless.
I also recommend the 1984 editions of Panorama and Question time that go along with it (they're both on YT last time I checked).
Not at all related but okay.
How the fuck isn't it related? You explicitly mentioned old labour.
>mentions old labour in a discussion about voting preferences with regards towards social issues
<GUISE OLD LABOR WAS IMPERIALIST!!!11!1!
It wasn't relevant to the discussion mate.
You see that guy who fired one into a bus, fucking state of London
He stated that Jeremy represented Old labor. Stop being pedantic, Old labour was mentioned and I posted the video to educate others that Old Labour wasn't any better than new labour.
Before we get bogged down into reading the arcane meaning behind his post. I leave that video, other new browsers can research about Old Labour. Sorry petty-booj fags.
Are you American by any chance?
No, I'm from London. Why?
Old Lab was kind of shitty but we don't talk about it because it enables us to claim their heritage while pushing our own agenda.
Probably because of
Can't you shill for your third worldist crap somewhere else?
The history of human society is one of war, peace is just the space between one war to the next.
Revolution again is just a class based war.
You sure about that? What Borough? Regardless, you understand that critiques of Old Labour among Communist circles (which I agree wholeheartedly with btw) shouldn't be explicitly publicised as our "line" or prevent us from tactically supporting Labour right? Like it's actually just incredibly shitty strategy to screech about Old Labour's legacy in a manner such as this. The current Labour party foreign policy is qualitatively different from that of it's Imperial forebearers anyhow, a better use of our time would be to force that further in line with our Anti-Imperialist views as opposed from alienating yourselves from people by shitting on a legacy that is fondly remembered.
Nobody is screeching about it you autist he posted a single link to a relevant history video.
Lmao yeah I'm the autistic one sure.
I would make a graph showing how much more effort you've put into getting mad over a youtube link than he has posting it but then I would be the veritable autist of the thread.
No-one gives a fuck about being the "autist of the thread" retard, where do you think we are? The point was that there was a very clear intent behind that link on that posters part, which simply just wasn't related to the point the Trot was making. If he wants to critique Old Labour he's perfectly welcome to, in fact, make an actual post about it instead of derisively greentexting with a link.
Yeah you're right, my bad, we're all just really mad besides you.
That's hardly related. I didn't claim Old Labour was socialist or revolutionary or /ourguys/. I didn't claim Jeremy will lead the revolution. I merely explained that the Labour party is different from the Democrats in the US and that this contributes to the different political mood in the two countries.
Unless your contention is that Old Labour and New Labour are a meaningless distinction altogether then its irrelevant to point out that Labour governments have been no less imperialist than any others.
This whole thread is basically a British/leftist stream of consciousness written by a dozen people so it seems a little odd people are getting mad at him for starting a new topic because it's only tangentially related to the post before it.
He just saw an opportunity to criticise Old Labour and took it.
I mean all i said was
>Not at all related but okay.
He was the one that got mad and claimed 'its related because i said 'Old Labour' as if had i mentioned 'NSDAP' a documentary about hitler's rise to power would be in order. I've no issue with the content itself.
Oh shit, I'm sorry I didn't realise this was 2009 cuckchan
That's okay anon, just don't let it happen again.
Good talk lad, let's get back on topic now
Soon all Johnsons will be where they along, on girls (m).
They're saying this is the last chance for a tory united front on brexit, this is gonna be good.
He mentioned it in relation to Benn and Bevan: who were firm anti-imperialists.
Regardless, the convo was with regards to voting patterns, not really relevant.
This is pretty bad from a long term strategy perspective. We need the Tories to hard Brexit or we're going to have a CDU tier cucklab government.
Walthamstow, my auto-correct puts labour back to labor. Pirated windows.
Do you want my passport picture too? Shall I show my scars?
How the fuck is this mong not banned yet?
Oh shit fam you're near me, I'm in Southgate. That part was just a shitpost lmao, you gotta keep an eye out for burgers round here.
Look how mad all the rad-libs got for my posting of that video. Can't WAIT to see your dissapointed faces when Jeremy gets in and NOTHING changes.
You really think Labour's gonna stop arms deals with saudi arabia? Even when the majority of labour voted for the bombing of Syria. Even my local Labour MP, stella creasy, voted for it. Yet she decries Europe's treatment of refugees from that area.
REFORM REFORM REFORM.
YOU MUST VOTE.
NEVER STOP THIS MERRY GO ROUND.
You two should just join your local IWW branch and fuck already
Isn't she getting deselected?
Speaking of IWW, how the fuck does anyone find anything on wobchat?
Trying to find resources for dealing with a landlord but can't fucking find anything
> Even when the majority of labour voted for the bombing of Syria.
<220 Labour MPs voted against the Government
<Stella Creasy (Walthamstow)
You fucking high bruv?
they are pretty useless LARPing students and academic types. Tthe main guys who is trying to set up an IWW branch in my area are lectures and students.
Acorn are pretty good they are a tenant union
Except that's not what anyone said, and you're literally lying (on both counts), which is crazy because you don't need to lie obviously at least half of labour MPs are Succdems at best we all know that, like jesus lad have some modicum of respect.
Nah mate, if Labour got into government we could negotiate a Brexit deal pretty fucking quickly because they don't have to deal with the fucking electoral win go the Orange Order.
Are you the guy from walthamstow? because I've met a number of london wobblies and few of them are students
No idea, only just started thinking of joining myself and was only taking the piss.
I saw 15 of them get put on trial for stopping the deportation of 60 LGBT asylum seekers, seemed a pretty poor return on investment for radicals tbqh.
They seem pretty active in some areas and basically absent in other registered branches. I was drawn towards them because they have a radical mission objective, unlike a lot of unions that cuck out because they're too pussy to be the first to do something (like the total lack of union reaction when the Royal Mail was sold for a pittance). Can you get me up to speed?
The EU has no state aid and anti-nationalisation tattooed on its forehead, every deal would be shit because of it.
Sorry for the typo, I know some losers on here will pick out that single mistake and brush off the entire post. Pathetic.
The absolute state of you lad.
Can you tell me what's going on rather than expecting me to read ten minutes of shit it took you twenty seconds to write?
Stell creasy DID vote to bomb syria:
>The outspoken MP, who lost her bid for the Labour deputy leadership in September, has come under fire from some of her constituents for voting in favour of military action in Syria. She has called a public meeting on Sunday to discuss her decision.
Dianne Abbot voted to INTERVENE in libya.
But like I said isn't Creasy getting deselected? No surprise on Abbott being fucking retarded though.
The IWW in the UK is in a weird place at the minute, as you said some groups are very active, other groups dont do much, a lot of what causes this is down to there deliberately not being any paid organisers, which means we don't cuck out but also means we don't have full time professionals doing all the busy work
At the minute Wales and Scotland are fairly busy, and all the groups in a line from Liverpool to Scunthorpe or so are quite strong, London is growing quickly and Ireland is growing even faster but is somewhat fragmented because of the distances between each area branch there
Overall there's decent activity in each region but we've got dead spots where the groups more or less only exist on paper, and might come out for things organised by other areas' groups but don't do much off of their own initiative
Neat, an IWW member. Sup!
Are the shit leaders entrenched with a bunch of cronies, how do you start your own branch, and how radical is the average organiser? Does ideology differ from boilerplate syndicalism from branch to branch>
>The EU has no state aid and anti-nationalisation tattooed on its forehead, every deal would be shit because of it.
That's the single market: leave the single market and no state-aid rules. It is actually legit that simple.
You're getting confused mate: she voted against bombing in 2013 (against Assad) and for in 2015 (Against ISIS).
Libya is actually an interesting case because it broke a lot of people: for example it turned the Blairite supporter of Iraq David Lammy into a vulgar anti-imperialist (who opposed bombing ISIS). I will forgive people being wrong about Libya because it changed so many minds.
>I will forgive people being wrong about Libya because it changed so many minds.
Why didn't the illegal GENOCIDE of Iraq by the west change peoples minds? Are they silly, naive children?
Bumbling empire? Wow I didn't know our MPs, who spent years studying politics in the best schools/unis, are so silly!
Also your part about stella is either objectively wrong or those articles i posted are outright lies.
>Creasy allegedly received threats via social media following her vote for extending UK military action against ISIS to Syria after the parliamentary debate on 2 December 2015. Creasy was undecided until the day of the vote, while staff in her Walthamstow constituency office had to deal with what they referred to as harassing telephone calls. Protesters had gathered outside the office the previous night urging a 'no' vote. On Facebook, Creasy defended their right to peaceful protest. Reports that protesters had gathered outside her home proved to be unfounded.
Shit leaders aren't really entrenched, but it can occasionally be slow to get someone out of a post and someone in to fill them, because of the aforementioned lack of professionalism, it was like 3 months between our main comms guy standing down and his replacement being fully into the role
>starting your own branch
Its not that difficult to start one, as there isn't much you have to actually do to get the OK, but it can take a while for material etc. to reach you depending on where you are, for example when our branch started we just drove a couple hours and picked up a couple boxes worth of stuff from the largest branch near us, but if you're somewhere miles away from anyone else getting physical material can be a pain in the arse
organisers vary pretty widely, our one is a pretty old school anarchist, I've met ones from other branches that are involved in TUC stuff professionally and do this on the side and I think at least one local branch is headed by a burnout from the communist party who got pissed off with everything and jumped ship
Ideology runs the gamut, most are bog standard syndicalist types, mostly leaning to anarchism but the iww has never "officially" been of any one ideology, there are a lot Dem Socs for example, a few trots (inevitable), and at one point it looked the CPI was going to collapse and a lot of their members were going to come our way but that never happened so so far we don't have that many ☭TANKIE☭s
>Creasy allegedly received threats via social media following her vote for extending UK military action against ISIS to Syria after the parliamentary debate on 2 December 2015. Creasy was undecided until the day of the vote, while staff in her Walthamstow constituency office had to deal with what they referred to as harassing telephone calls. Protesters had gathered outside the office the previous night urging a 'no' vote. On Facebook, Creasy defended their right to peaceful protest. Reports that protesters had gathered outside her home proved to be unfounded.
As I said the 2015 vote on bombing Syria, she voted against bombing Assad in 2013.
Is there much stopping you from taking the initiative? What's the day to day operations of a busy organising branch like?
*Bombing ISIS in Syria, fuck.
The main stopping people from taking the initiative is time, there isn't enough of it
If you're working 40 hours a week trying to then go out and spend at least 10 hours a week working on the IWW as well is difficult for a lot of people, I can do it, because I don't have many other commitments, but if you've got kids etc. it quickly builds up and you have to try and plan everything around that. The other problem is that "organising" in the traditional sense is something a lot of people find intimidating, trying to unionise colleagues in your own workplace is risky when its the sort of workplace the IWW targets, standing outside all day and approaching people on their lunch break or the end of their shift is also something a lot of people don't like doing, you get a lot of bad reactions from workers themselves who think you're taking the piss as well as attention from security, depending on where it is you get pestered by drunks and occasionally the police, and its also fucking boring and massively time consuming (see problem one)
In most of the successful branches you've got a core group of 10+ people who are really active and are the people that go out to do most of the on the ground stuff, direct recruiting, salting etc. people that don't mind having to be thick-skinned and have a decent amount of free time outside work. You then also typically have a supporting group of people that can't or won't do direct stuff, but will turn out for rallies, recruiting events like bookfairs, talks that are put on, and will help run day to day tasks like emailing people, getting funding together for events, providing catering for said events as well as planning actions like a strike or a campaign around a specific issue
You'll also get a lot of paper members, people that pay dues but don't do anything and don't respond to messages, people seem to like having the card
But…….. she still voted for british bombs to be dropped on Syrian soil. Do you justify it because it was "ISIS"? You know, that western creation?
Out of interest, who was justified in fighting ISIS and who wasn't?
I'm not sure whether you're claiming ISIS doesn't/didn't actually exist and they were just an excuse to bomb Syria or that ISIS is real and was sponsored by the west and somehow this means they shouldn't be bombed. Also somehow ISIS, an enemy of the Syrian State, is meant to be guaranteed protection by Syrian territorial sovereignty now. Where are you going with this?
Can you work under a false name as an organiser? I'd like to unionise Amazon workers but they're so ubiquitous online I'm roped in with them.
What's it like internally? Full of nobooks, social climbers, theorists?
What are the dues spent on?
Why not let the fucking Syrian state deal with ISIS INSTEAD of undermining them? Didn't take much genius to come up with that idea!
Are YOU now going to claim that Britain hasn't tried to undermine the Syrian state? If there was NO western intervention in Syria then the "ISIS" problem would have been dealt with in a month.
What do you mean by false name?
If you mean giving a false one to people that you're trying to organise yes and there's nothing stopping from setting up another email or blind facebook account to use solely for the IWW, but the GMB will likely want to know your real name at some point for matters of trust more than anything
Internally its a complete hodgepodge, from people that read everything they can get their hands on to babby's first radicalism, there isn't much social climbing, because being in a more important role just means more work without any more reward
Dues are spent on funding events, printing material purchasing equipment (think printers and loud-hailers not cars) and expenses, this can be anything from covering catering costs for something we're putting on to hotel and travel expenses for members attending events in different areas, expensive things like plane tickets are usually paid by members themselves up front then reclaimed later, for example I went to sheffield a couple months ago for a summit, paid my expenses up front then claimed them back when I got home